Lori Gold
Jared:
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Hello everybody and welcome to the Kajabi Edge Podcast, where we talk to real entrepreneurs to give you an edge on Kajabi. I’m your host Jared Lohman, Vice President of Customer Experience, and today I’m joined by Lori Gold, creator of the Explore More Mexico Master Class. How are you doing today Lori?
Lori:
Pretty good, thanks! How about you?
Jared:
Very good! Thank you for joining us. Well I’d love for you to just kind of give us the elevator pitch, tell us more about what it is that you do on Kajabi?
Lori:
Okay the elevator pitch I guess is that, I have created master classes for travel advisors to help them sell Mexico better.
Jared:
Okay, okay! And what’s kind of the history on that like why Mexico in particular? What got you going there?
Lori:
Okay great question! So I have been a travel advisor for about 14 and a half years, and then Covid happened. And my clients are Canadian SMI and Canadians still have not really traveled outside of Canada. So my business is sort of on hold and the main way that I make money is really hasn’t happened, you know, in the past year and a half or so. And last year I decided to create a Facebook group for the Riviera Maya, it’s called The Resorts of the Riviera Maya. Because I was in destination before anyone else when things started opening up again. Or should have said that I live in the Riviera Maya. Now I don’t live in Canada but I live in Riviera Maya Mexico, so I was there last June when the resort started opening up again.
And there's a lot of changes that have happened since Covid right? So I was going around to the resorts and doing site inspections and finding out about all these changes. And then I was spamming like all these different Facebook groups that I was in with my pictures and my summaries and everything that has changed. And I thought I was being kind of annoying by doing that, so I decided to create my own group and whoever is interested can come into my group.
And today we are at I think 8,500 advisors from Canada and the U.S. Yeah, the group is extremely active and everyone said that it is their favorite group on Facebook, and I really take it like seriously. And it did become a full time job without pay, you know over the past year and a half, over the past years essentially. It really did, I mean it took up so much of my time which is fine because I really didn't have anything else to do.
And I was going around the destination and doing different excursions and tours, and seeing more hotels and just sharing it with the group and it became, you know, a really great place for people to get information, share information. Especially last year we had 3 hurricanes, so everyone sort of came together and was helping each other and you know, whoever was in destination was really helping the agency world. So it became a really really amazing community.
And a friend of mine suggested that I do, you know, classes for them. And I thought that was genius, because I felt like there’s a huge need for someone who’s sort of impartial. You know not the tourist board necessarily, maybe they have vested interest. Not one hotel group because of course they’re only gonna showcase their hotels. Even a tour operator, maybe they're only gonna showcase what they sell, things like that and I don’t have any vested interest in anything that I recommend.
So I thought that was a great idea to present to my group because there were a lot of agents that were coming over from specializing in other areas of the world. So things like Europe that was closed, or cruising that wasn’t happening, Asia things like that. Mexico is really one of the main countries that was completely open the entire time. You know, there’s no testing requirements, there’s no restrictions, like anyone is welcome, door is open, come in.
So a lot of these agents were brand new to selling the destination, and you could tell, with the questions that were being asked and things like that. So I decided to create a master class for them. And another agent friend of mine runs a course through Kajabi, so he told me about Kajabi as a way to sell my master class. And that’s how we got to where we are right now.
Jared:
Very cool! Well I’d love to even just turn the timeline back a little bit further like... where were you at before all of these? You mentioned being in the travel industry, like what did your day to day look like prior to this whole transition?
Lori:
Yeah! It was just simply working with customers, clients and booking trips, and doing research and things like that. I never really worked with travel advisors before. I was you know, just friends with them and Facebook groups with them, and everything like that. But yeah, just booking trips and research, and itineraries, and things like that.
Jared:
Okay! And so the kind of pandemic situation ultimately sparked the need to do something different. So essentially 0 to 8,500 people in the community, that’s incredibly impressive! That's something I know that we’re going to want to dig in further. But before we go there, I’d love to kind of just...I guess zoom in a little bit more on that entry point into moving into the digital space. You heard about Kajabi from a friend. What did that process look like for you? What were the struggles? What were the challenges in kind of getting this new idea and bringing it to life?
Lori:
Well, the struggle is that I had no idea what I was doing. You know, even though I’m a millennial, I’m not really like technologically advanced. Look I’m good on Facebook and Instagram, but really nothing else. I don’t do any marketing for my business, for my travel business like I’ve never once marketed, it’s all referrals and repeat business. So it really was something completely new and once I decided to move forward with the classes I’m like “Okay, I need to get this done right away.” And my friend who has this course on Kajabi, he mentioned that he has a team that I can hire, and you know, I know with the Facebook group people are always offering their services, but I didn’t have time for that. I’m like...I need to get this out like by Monday. Because if I don’t do it now, I’m never gonna do it.
And so, I literally like launched it or I told the group that it’s happening on a certain date, so that I would put the pressure on myself to get it done. And like I said the struggle was that I had no idea what I was doing, so I sat there for like a weekend and I did all the different webinars that I could - the live webinars that were available that weekend, that sort of had something to do with what I needed. I would ask questions in the webinars and then I just sat on my computer and just chatted with support like all day all night, and just got it done.
And my pages are...whatever they are called, I don’t even know the terminology but whatever I have, it’s not pretty, it’s not anything fancy, like it’s just very basic, but that’s all I needed. I just needed a way to sell my course and get people registered.
Jared:
Yeah. So did you come to the table with kind of a formulated strategy in mind of what you wanted to accomplish? Or did you just like...you knew you needed to do this and you’re going to figure out a way to do it?
Lori:
I had zero strategy and that’s why I think I’m a little bit different than some of the old people that I see in the group like...I think also - I'm gonna back up a little bit. One of the main differences about what I’m doing versus some other people is that I created this community without the intention to sell them. And I honestly think that makes a huge difference, because they don’t feel like I’m trying to sell to them. They want it, they need it, like they’re so happy, you know what I mean?
And I think that is like one of the biggest takeaways is that I, I haven’t...I mean I don't need people to come off of this podcast and come to my classes. I have a built in audience essentially and they just want more and more and more. So I don’t have to find the people, I don't have to advertise it anywhere except my little community or right now it’s kind of a big community. And they never felt like they were getting sold to because they just needed it, like they really just needed it, you know.
And I had no idea what I was doing, I still don’t have any strategy. Whenever I feel like it, like okay well...I haven't made any money in a few weeks, I’m just gonna do the same course, just another live course you know, and people sign up and that’s it!
Jared:
Let’s talk a little more about...kind of like, what is the structure of your offering? Is it primarily like a...sounds like a live...there’s a live component to it? What’s that look like?
Lori:
It’s just one live Zoom master class essentially. It’s like an hour and a half, 2 hours and then afterwards they get like a free takeaway, and that’s it! It’s really simple, there’s no like...you know upsells or anything like that, it’s just one thing. And then when I watched the 1st one, I had already started working with the 2nd one. And then I gave that 2nd one to the people from the 1st one and had a 20% discount. And I mean I can check my opening rate but I think it was extremely high, like 75% or something. And a ton of people signed up to the 2nd one from the 1st ones like...“Okay it’s something right there.”
Jared:
Yeah. Sounds like you built an amazing audience. How did you? I guess did you... when you went to kind of to start this process were you specifically targeting travel agents? And how on earth did you find 8,500 travel agents? Or is this also people like, you know anyone else who might be just interested in exploring Mexico?
Lori:
No, it’s only for travel advisors and I’m very strict and I vet every single person that comes in the group - if it’s a [inaudible 9:25] and then I also vet them. So, it’s very targeted group and really they just came, then as I share more they kept coming. And then I created a Google document which I think now has like 16 pages, full of all kinds of different information like resort contacts, and just a list of different things and tons and tons of information, and so people come as they heard about that.
And then twice including once last week, I asked everybody to invite one friend, one amazing travel agent friend and of course people invited like... a lot more than that. So I got like you know hundreds and hundreds of new people just from that. So really I think that it’s just providing like free content. And I did that for a year before I asked them to pay for anything and not everyone can do that right?
So, that is something that I was able to do, that I didn't even think...I never thought I was going to charge them for anything, so I was happy to just provide it for free. And then it worked out that I could charge them for something. So I did provide like a year of content and just given them information, and showing up everyday, and engaging like doing polls, and asking me random questions about you know...about travel in the Riviera Maya. But really just engaging them and providing them content and then they trust me, and they know I’m an expert. So selling them a class was like no problem.
Jared:
That’s amazing! Definitely a common thread that I hear amongst all of the people that we’ve spoke with on this podcast. I’m curious like...how did you? What was 0 to 1 or maybe 0 to 10 look like? That feels like...sounds like you had a really great strategy to actually bring in like...you know sharing us with your friends, bringing in referrals which is cool, but like that 0 to1 or 0 to 10, maybe even 0 to 100 like how did you start?
Lori:
I put a poll in the group if I remember correctly, and I ask if people will be interested or maybe which topics they would be interested in? And they just started putting their emails in the comment section and I was like “I’m not...I don’t even have a class created yet, like calm down,” you know. But it was good because then when I did launch it, I emailed all those people as well. Maybe they have already signed up, maybe they haven't, oh! I think I actually checked-maybe. But I emailed all of them as well because you know not everyone sees everything on Facebook, that's the trouble with the algorithm you know only certain people see it.
So, I started with a poll asking them if they would be interested, and then you know...what type of content they would be interested in? And that poll went like crazy and then 1 person put their email, and then people thought I was collecting emails which I was not. And then they all started putting their emails, so I have this little mini email list, but really like anything...because I’m the admin of the group I think anything I do gets a lot of attention, anything I post, so just post it and people sign up.
And then once I did the 1st class people wrote in the group, they posted it whoever hasn't been in the class... So people were advertising for me without me even asking because they were just so excited about it. They were advertising for it for me in my group.
Jared:
Amazing! Actually I’d like to even go like take that a step back further when building that group. How did you actually get an audience into that group? Did you start out in your personal Facebook page? Or how did you start building it?
Lori:
No! I mean I have a lot of friends in the travel agent community so I invited them first, and then they’re like “Oh this is cool” and they invited all of their friends. And I’m in a lot of other travel agent Facebook groups, about all different things, not...they weren't really...until this point a lot of people now have copied my idea with different destinations. But before that they were more general and not destination focused, so I would post it in there and someone would have a question, I would say “Oh you can join my group and you can get a better answer that way or whatever.”
So really it’s the same on how I built my travel advisor business like word of mouth and referrals, and that’s it! It really just snowballed. Maybe at the beginning I posted in other groups but I haven't posted in in groups in--for sure a year already. But other people see all the time, if someone has a question in another group they say “Oh you should join” and they tag my group. So other people do it for me essentially.
Jared:
Yeah, I love that! Really it sounds like just starting with your own network. The network that you’ve already invested in which is something that I think a lot of people take for granted when they’re getting started. Like you see people immediately jumped to paid advertising, or trying to build their audience and areas that they have no familiarity with. But you really demonstrated this ability to utilize something that you already had, to ultimately generate almost like a...I don't know, a growth machine for yourself, which is pretty incredible!
Well we talked a little bit about the kind of the technical challenges or just like not knowing where to go. Like once you kind of achieved success, did you... Achieved success is maybe not the right way to put it. But you got your initial cohort in your 1st class like what happened next?
Edit ended 14:05
Lori:
Next...once I finished the content which I have to...you know it was very late until the night before because I didn’t think it would be... take so long and everything like that, then we just started creating another one. So I just had two courses sort of running at the same time and I would do them. Honestly I think I’ve only done it because I have two classes, two different classes and one of them I think I’ve done I think three times, and one of them only twice so far. And the next we’ve been doing like one more of each, so I just created a new one. And of what people...what I knew people wanted.
Jared:
Yeah, momentum! It kind of building upon the momentum that you had in place there. Beyond that did you run into any struggles? Or you feel like this is kind of been just in motion ever since?
Lori:
I haven’t really, I mean the only sort of struggle is that sometimes people don't get the emails, or goes to their junk, or their spammer, or whatever. They don't check that even though I tell them to, in my 1st you know...in the landing page it says that. In the first email that they get and things like that, so that’s a tiny struggle. You know...a lot of people don't read that as a struggle. [inaudible 15:09] or anything like that.
But no it’s been pretty smooth and to be honest I haven’t...I started in June, yeah I think it was in June. And I haven’t like made anything prettier or spent any money hiring anyone, or anything like that. I just don’t know for me that it’s necessary like people just want a content, so that’s sort of not important.
Jared:
Yeah, I think that’s probably music to a lot of people's ears. You know if you have the right idea and you...sounds like at least your strategy was “Let’s give people what they’re asking for.” I think you made a brilliant move at the gate and said “Hey! What are you interested in?” Which is I think a step that so many of us often forget is you know...what do our customers ultimately want from us? Sounds like you’re really in real time motion like...What’s changed for you? I mean I know everything in some ways, given that you’re in the travel industry and you know in a pandemic, like what’s different for you now?
Lori:
Well you know I don’t have an income from travel right now, for the most part. And I never...this is my only job being a travel advisor my whole life, it’s my only job. So I never thought that there was anything out there for me and now, I mean I don’t know how far these classes are gonna go. I do have a lot more ideas and I have...because after each of my classes they do get a survey asking again what else do they want to learn about. And so I know what they want right? So I can create more classes that people actually will want to join.
And hopefully I can create a lot more and I’m already thinking about partnering with other advisors who are specialists in things that I’m not, to creating a more courses or master classes. And it’s a new way of income for me that I don’t have to worry about what’s going on in the world really, you know if travel gets shut down again. If Canadians can’t travel, if Americans can’t travel, I have another source of income which you know has really been a dream for the last while is to have that.
And I wouldn’t say that it’s passive, it’s definitely not passive as of course maybe because I am giving them live. But if I’m giving them live like you know, if 2 people sign up or 100 will sign up, like I'm just doing it at once and not getting...and for all my 5 classes they did sell out by the way to 100 people, which is the most I can do on my Zoom account, so that was great!
And now, people are wanting to buy the recordings. So I haven’t...I have sold them a little bit...I have an advertiser, I think if I had advertised it I could do more that way, but I haven’t really arranged that yet, like a good way to do that. So that will make it a little bit more passive, but right now I mean it’s a whole new way of earning money for me, which I never thought was possible. So yeah, I mean I’m back to making money, which is great!
Jared:
That’s amazing! I’m just kinda curious, I told you this at the gate I’m bad at geography. How big is like...is the Riviera Maya big enough where...can you further dissect that down and focus on particular areas or is the next strategy to broaden that and perhaps touch other areas of Mexico. What’s that look like?
Lori:
So, it’s not huge but there’s a lot in it. So for example my second class was just about Tulum, which is one city in the Riviera Maya. So the first one was just a general class, the second one was just about Tulum and I could do once just about a lot of other areas. But I have other ideas, for example people are really interested in excursions and off the beaten path things like that. I can do one just on resorts. I'm gonna do one with an expert, just on accessible travel with destination and one on destination weddings.
So there’s all different kinds of things that we can do without even going anywhere else like the destination. And you know like I said earlier some people have...I don’t wanna say copied because it’s not like proprietary but they use my idea of the Facebook group. They created their own for different destinations that they’re specialists in and they are already planning on doing courses as well. So I don't plan to do anything outside of this area, this is the area that I live in, that I love, that I’m passionate about, that I specialize in. So there’s a lot to dissect still in that area.
Jared:
Sure! I bet you...I mean although obviously this industry has been impacted pretty hard by the pandemic. I’d have to guess that there is a strong appetite if nothing else for as soon as you know...as anyone feels comfortable, as soon as there's...I guess an openness to do so. I can imagine that it will be absolutely a booming industry in the near future.
Lori:
Yeah, It’s a 100%! I hope. Although if not I always have my classes.
Jared:
Yeah! Are you sensing I guess through your audience do you guys...are you feeling some of that excitement or anticipations surrounding travelling or how is that looking?
Lori:
Well to be honest most of my group members, they are Americans. There's just more American travel agents you know and also they’ve been booking travel for longer since travel opened again. Because Americans have been travelling since last June. So that excitement period is sort of over and now we’re in the period where we don’t know what’s gonna happen again, because people are starting to get nervous again. So I’m not sure what the future holds with that.
Jared:
Yeah, yeah! That makes sense. Well I guess this is...I'm jumping around a little bit on this one. I guess when you were getting started, when you found Kajabi, did you explore any other platforms or was it just like you went straight to Kajabi?
Lori:
So that’s a really good question and something that I did want to address. I didn’t explore anything else to be honest because my friend Will told me about it. He's really good at what he does and I trust him. And I don’t have enough knowledge to even explore other options and know the differences and everything like that. And so I just jumped in. You know I really just jumped in.
And talking to a friend of mine who is a coach of some sort and does have courses, when I told her that I was you know joining Kajabi, she said you know you don’t really need that because you don't have like courses that you’re selling, like it’s just a one time webinar type of thing. You probably don’t need it and it’s expensive Kajabi and there's ways that you can do it. And she told me all the different things that she pays for separately and I was like “It is not worth it to do that.”
Like I...someone like me who has no technology experience and doesn’t know what I’m doing like... forget it! I don’t care how much more I have to pay, I mean to an extent you know. But realistically I just need something that everything is in one place and I have 1 username, 1 password, 1 fee per month and that’s it. And that was a big thing for me like...Of course it’s tempting to save money but to have the ease that everything just in one place and not having all different accounts, and linking them together in a website like...forget it! I couldn't do that. So I’m really happy to have everything in one umbrella.
Jared:
So I guess tell me a little bit more about what’s next for you given the uncertainty in the industry like...how do you continue to really develop and invest into what you’ve created so far?
Lori:
So the future is definitely uncertain, especially with Canadians and my Canadian clients which make up you know... 98 or 99% of my client base. And to be honest it’s been extremely stressful, the ones that I am working with just put changes and cancellations and hesitations and things like that. So since I’ve been doing these master classes, I really found a passion in helping other advisors. And I'm trying to come up with other ways that I can do that and sort of make money from that versus putting all my eggs in the travel advisor basket. I don’t think I will ever give up my name you know...income and career because it’s really successful on its own. But I like having you know-another option that I am passionate about also.
However in the future if it does...if travel does come back, well hopefully when travel does come back to what it was before, you know I won’t have time to do everything. I didn’t have time to do everything back then, I won't in the future. So I think having Kajabi would be great because I can put my classes on there to sell the recordings and things like that, so I don't have to do them all live.
Which again I mentioned earlier that I was thinking about that, but I haven’t even done it yet. I’m sort of just like piece nailing it together like...having people pay for an old class, and then sending them the link thru email and it's like you know...I’m sure that there's a way, better way to do it through Kajabi that I haven’t explored yet. So I hope to have that set up and utilize it even more that way, so that there is some half an income coming in for the time set.
I don’t have time to do live classes all the time because they do take up you know the preparation, and getting nervous in front of the class, and doing the classes, you know everything like that. So there will be a time when I can’t do as much of that, and so it will be great to have that...you know the classes and Kajabi set up that I can just sell them, sell the recordings.
Jared:
Yeah! I mean I always like to kind of look for the silver line and it sounds like that’s kind of that was that. It afforded you the opportunity and time to invest in something that you may otherwise, you know...have never actually done or never even explored this path.
Lori:
For sure, Yeah! I would not have. Thanks to my friend for her great idea to do this, because it truly has been life changing this year.
Jared:
Yeah. I mean the magic I think that I’m hearing from you is all around your audience building, which I think is really cool! I think it’s very applicable like...that’s one of the areas that people struggle with the most, undoubtedly is finding their footing. It’s not usually like having an idea to create it, there’s a billion ideas but finding that group of people who are interested in potentially consuming that content is such a common challenge though.
Lori:
Yeah. I think that’s what I see is also the hardest part for people in the Facebook group. But I think the challenge though is that for some of us already coming into Kajabi that probably knew they already have an idea, you can’t...Like what I did was unintentional and it’s hard to do that if you already know that you want to sell to them, you know what I mean? So, because like I said my community is what it is, I think because they didn’t feel like they were being sold to the whole time.
So creating a community that doesn’t feel like that I think is so important and giving information for free, I mean no one wants to do it, but we have to. You know I think that’s again you don’t have to do it for a year like I did, but you do have to do it for an extended period of time so that people trust you. And not only that, but my group they want to pay me. Like they tried to do like you know...GoFundMe or things like that from before. I’m like “No no no, I don’t feel comfortable with that.” You know they want to support me, they wanna pay me back for everything I do for them.
So this course is like... in their opinion like the least they could do in a sense. So they’re like...they want to pay and you know that’s really what you want. You want people to want you no like be gradually feel bad so they pay you. They're like dying to pay me.
Jared:
I love that! And that completely resonates like... that is the main reason we actually put together this podcast is to inspire and to promote entrepreneurship. And to expose this to people who may not otherwise take the leap, like you know everyone on this podcast has. So completely resonates. Well thank you Lori for joining us today. It has been super fun hearing about this journey, obviously a crazy one, travel during the pandemic.
But really cool to hear how you’ve invested in building such an incredible audience in...I would say an incredibly short amount of time. Like what you’ve amassed in such a short period of time is incredible, speaks to the value that you’ve been able to offer. So if anyone wanted to get a hold of you or kind of explore what you’re doing more, what’s the best way for them to find you?
Lori:
I would say the best way is through Instagram and it’s @explorewithlor L-O-R.
Jared:
Cool! Thank you again for joining us Lori. We really appreciate you.
Lori:
My pleasure! It’s great to be here.
Jared:
Well for all of our listeners as always we would greatly appreciate you hopping on to your favorite podcasting platform leaving us a review. I check them all personally. Share this with your friends. Thank you all for listening today and we will look forward to seeing you next time on the Kajabi Edge Podcast.
